Roger Helmer MEP on Ken Clarke and comments about rape

Following his recent blogpost on the subject of Ken Clarke, and the comments made about rape Roger Helmer MEP has recorded an exclusive podcast for Tory Radio to clarify exactly what he said, he said following intense interest in his original piece.

To listen to the podcast click the play button below.


17 Responses to Roger Helmer MEP on Ken Clarke and comments about rape

  1. miamarshmallow says:

    You DID say that the victim hold responsibility if she gets raped in her boyfriends bed.
    you said that 'no means no' is a cliche, reducing it's power. It is a truism, not a cliche.

    You did actually say that. Are you taking it back? are you going to apologise for reinforcing that rape myth?

    • toryradio says:

      Why don't you express some anger that a rape which when committed with violence could possibly get more prison time for the violence part than the rape itself – aren't you outraged about that? I know I am.

      Why aren't you calling for the Tory party to not consider any increase in tariff reduction for an early guilty plea for any serious crime? Aren't you outraged that an early guilty plea already gets a tariff reduction and the consultation could increase that to 50%? Is that what you want?

      Why aren't you backing people like me who suggest if there aren't enough prison places, we should build more?

      I don't hear you talking about the real substantive issues.

  2. Roger Helmer's podcast does not address why he thinks that the victim shares a part of the responsibility.

    He says that women 'provoke' rape by getting themselves in bad situations – such as "getting cold feet". Men are then "unable to restrain themselves" and therefore "less culpable". In other words, women share responsibility because of their naivety and bad judgement.

    Here are Roger Helmer's exact words:
    "But at the last minute she gets cold feet and says “Stop!”. The young man, in the heat of the moment, is unable to restrain himself and carries on."
    "I think that most right-thinking people would expect a much lighter sentence in the second case"
    "in the second case the victim surely shares a part of the responsibility, if only for establishing reasonable expectations in her boyfriend’s mind"

    Mr Helmer says that he doesn't understand what the disagreement is about. The three quotes above are offensive and damaging to victims of rape, and degrade both genders. They are based on regressive assumptions and do not represent the views of modern society.

    Mr Helmer states that "classic stranger rape" is more serious or "culpable" than relationship rape, when this is untrue. Such views were outlawed when marital rape became illegal, so it is unclear why Mr Helmer continues to hold them. Both cases present acts of rape, and the responsibility of the rapist in both cases is the same. RAPE is RAPE – relationship status does not constitute a mitigating circumstance.

    It is very well to say that all rape is serious, but that is no excuse for thinking that the victim shares a part of the responsibility. Mr Helmer ought to apologise for his comments and retract them immediately.

    TWITTER @SackRogerHelmer

  3. spiller says:

    It wasn’t “jolly nice” reading Roger Helmers blog… Nobody has got Roger Helmer “wrong” you do have an opinion of victims being partially to blame if they are in a relationship with a man and he can’t stop his urges… Roger Helmer should be sacked!

  4. feministletters says:

    Here is a direct quote from the Roger Helmer blog:

    "The second [case] is “date rape”.Imagine that a woman voluntarily goes to her boyfriend’s apartment, voluntarily goes into the bedroom, voluntarily undresses and gets into bed, perhaps anticipating sex, or naïvely expecting merely a cuddle. But at the last minute she gets cold feet and says “Stop!”. The young man, in the heat of the moment, is unable to restrain himself and carries on…`in the second case the victim surely shares a part of the responsibility, if only for establishing reasonable expectations in her boyfriend’s mind."

    If you cant see how this is victim blaming and how perpetuating this myth that men are "unable to restrain" themselves then you are the worst kind of ignorant misogynist.

    Furthermore, anyone with a modicum of intelligence should be able to see that being raped by a partner can have just as extreme effects for a person as "stranger-rape". Imagine being violated by someone you trusted above all others. Someone that you shared a home with. Do you honestly believe that just because its not a stranger in an alley way it isn't potentially violent, destructive and long lasting in its effects? If not, please refer to my earlier comments re ignorant misogynists.

    Cat @feministletters

    • toryradio says:

      OK – the last time of asking for everyone… please STOP using the word "you" referring to Roger Helmer as if this is his site and as if he will respond on this site. This is an independent site so if you are referring to someone, use THEIR NAME.

      Also please do not refer to comments that have not been made on this site, as people will wonder where they are.

      Interesting you have left two comments exactly the same, to two different blogposts, on two different sites. I do hope you downloaded the podcast and listened before commenting. I hope the tracking will not show you haven't? Thanks

      • miamarshmallow says:

        what has that got to do with anything? You're trying to derail her points.

        Roger didn't address ANY of the points made about victim blaming.

      • toryradio says:

        Its interesting as this blog post is very different to the blogpost where exactly the same comment was made – hence the same comment does not makes sense here… so making reference to "previous comments" on here is stupid as the commenter had not made any!

        I have no wish to derail anyones points – but if you don't like it, then do not visit. My website. My rules.

      • miamarshmallow says:

        What is wrong with leaving the same eloquent and well thought out comment on two separate websites?

        stunningly unprofessional response from a rep of the Tory party. 'if you do not like it don't visit' .
        It's precisely why i don't like 'it', that i am visiting, and i won't stop campaigning to have this man fired.

      • toryradio says:

        Let me explain again in small words so you can understand. I have no problem in comments being left. Lovely. When a commenter puts a comment used on another site, which is just cut and pasted to a blogpost on here and it does not make sense… for example by saying look at my "previous comments" when they have made none on here – it is not well thought out.

        Show me the "previous comments" made by that commenter then???

        Secondly – I am not a "representative" of any party – so get off your high horse and perhaps if you weren't so aggresive you may actually get further.

        Thirdly if you knew anything about politics you may know you can't sack an elected representative (though of course I am a fan of recall elections). You can have the party whip withdrawn and other such sanctions – but a campaign to get an MP or MEP "sacked" is actually doomed to failure. The point of democracy is it is the electorate who hires and fires – unless you prefer a dictatorship.

        Of course these specific points will no doubt be ignored. Then again… maybe your next comment will make sense. It might even get published. Who can tell.

        Have a thoroughly smashing day.

      • miamarshmallow says:

        you're making yourself look really really bad.

      • toryradio says:

        Third chance to answer the easy questions I put.. your silence really does speak volumes.

        Shall I ask again?

        1) How do you sack on MP or MEP?

        2) What comments in the original post which I responded to was that commenter referring to? There don't appear to be any on this site. If there aren't any my point was valid.

        Looking forward to your response.

      • Ex listener says:

        Wow. I think Roger's wrong about this, but forget about that.
        Your comments (tory radio) are just disgraceful. There is absolutely no cause for such rudeness; I normally listen to the podcasts but I really don't think I want to hear that attitude any more , never mind read it.

      • toryradio says:

        Disgraceful in what way? Or do you mean accurate?

        So I shouldn't take someone to task for posting a pasted comment that was used on another blog that made reference to comments never made on this site?

        Or perhaps that I am accurate in the fact that an MEP or MP cannot be sacked?

        Sorry that you no longer listen to the podcast anonymous.

  5. alice says:

    Roger Helmer. People have read and understood your blog, maybe you should have been more careful with your arguments.

    In your blog, you try to oversimplify a really very complicated issue and furthermore you do it badly. The example you provide is ludicrous and your words offend both males and females. They offend men, who not want to be represented as having no control of their "basic instincts" and you offend women who have struggled long and hard to get issues such as marital rape and date rape recognised as serious (and they are serious- and not nearly as straightforward as your inane example) offences.

    • alice says:

      You, as a polititian should recognise the damage that can be caused by a careless argument. You should recognise that you are putting your words into the public domain and you should think about how they will be interpreted, by everyone. Not just by your critics but also by those who might seek some justification for absolutely reprehensible actions or even from rape victims themselves who probably already blame themselves enough already.

      Personally, I hope that you think long and hard about whether you are a good representative of this country and the diverse range attitudes and opinions that it shares, since you are by your own admission such a bad representative of your own opinion.

  6. alice says:

    Roger Helmer Just to put my comments into perspective.

    The mirror represent your views like so…

    How would this be read by
    a) a man who recently raped his wife.
    b) a woman who was recently raped by her husband.

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